David Swanson, pastor of New Community Covenant Church, joins Rob and Jes on this episode of JUST. David is the author of “Rediscipling the White Church”, and also serves as the CEO of New Community Outreach, a non-profit organization working to reduce causes of trauma and raise opportunities for equity in Chicago.
0:00 Episode starts
1:30 Jes’s check in
4:08 Rob’s check in
6:02 David joins the conversation
7:09 Rob gives some background on David
10:00 How did David come to care about issues of justice and race?
13:24 Jes asks David to define and explain the title of his book
15:22 David describes three assumptions or tools that white organizations often use when addressing inequity
18:35 David acknowledges that there are many people against diversity, but he believes there is a large group that genuinely wants diversity and doesn’t know how to get there
20:24 Rob asks how the increased awareness of injustice impacts David’s book and message
21:35 The gravity of race is with those of us who are white
23:38 Interlude
24:05 Jes asks for some examples of how David’s church has been successful in cultivating diversity
25:08 Connecting discipleship with racial justice, instead of viewing it as ministry
26:09 David tells a story about two pastors who developed a fusion friendship that changed their churches
29:41 A relationship isn’t evidence of fixing injustice, it’s an ecosystem from which to work
30:57 Rob asks David for personal examples of fusion friendships that shaped his life
33:10 David shares his relationship with one of his mentors
34:39 Jes calls for the show up moment
36:15 David reframes to “what do I need to do to become more trustworthy to my friends and neighbors of color?”
39:23 Jes asks if there’s a network or high-level organization to coordinate this change
40:00 Rob gets “voluntold” to start the network
42:23 Jes calls for galvanization of racial reconciliation work
44:07 Rob thanks David for joining the show
44:54 David leaves the conversation
44:58 Debrief begins, Jes’s takeaways
45:47 Rob’s takeaways
50:19 Goodbyes and outro
Thank you to DJ Pdogg and Producer Lo Key for our awesome music throughout the show!
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Our hosts:
Jes Averhart, cofounder of Black Wallstreet Homecoming
Rob Shields, executive director of the Recity Network.
Our Producer:
Ben Azevedo, owner of Bear Cave Audio
Our Editor
Chris Pappalardo